Day Out Podcast Episode 1: Pat Bleasel Transcript

Pat you've just gotten back from um

Cambra 70.3 or challenge challenge

Cambra um and before that you're at

Melbourne so must be pretty pretty

bugged now pretty

tired yeah yeah yeah I am um we were

chatting before and I was just saying

how my body I thought it was just going

to like give out on me before camra like

in the lead up doing everything I could

like I pretty much lived on a trigger

ball and a foam roller um but everything

went well so I was really psyched that

it held up but it's now time for a break

100% the mind and the body's begging for

it yeah awesome man so you're you're in

you do disability work um and then

that's casual and you train outside of

that yeah yeah yeah that's right um I

still work like about a full-time load

for like 35 hours a week um but it's

pretty flexible in disability and I do

pretty awesome stuff like I get to take

people out to you know do fun stuff in

their life like bowling not that I love

bowling but that's an example yeah going

to the movies and that sort of stuff

it's pretty sick yeah and and that

balance works for you like that that

amount of work with that amount of

training that's that's enough to

juggle um I hear a lot of people saying

this um and I definitely agree with it

as well but I think there's just like

almost no way to be balanced

the amount of hours you've got to do for

Triathlon and like maintain a work like

a job um so it's just like you know 4:00

a.m. starts on weekdays um and also on

the weekends if I actually want to you

know keep my girlfriend and do stuff on

the weekend like I like to actually have

a life outside of triathon because I

mean I'm a nerd with it like I love

everything about it so I could think and

talk about it all day but it's just not

really good

yeah I think U like a lot of triathletes

you find yourself being really enthused

about it but to people not in it it's

like watching pain dry or like listening

to paint dry it's the most boring thing

um yeah yeah exactly yeah yeah and like

what's your athletic background how how

did you kind of get into Triathlon

because you you're only kind of I don't

know it seems like you're really hitting

momentum lately or

recently yeah I mean I've been in the

sports since

2020 um so only 3 years um and before

that my athletic background is literally

zero I went to a private school like

where it was very Pro Sport um and I

hated school so therefore I was very uh

anti- sport so I was just like a chubby

little kid who would um skip soccer on

the weekends to like smoke cigarettes at

the fores

shore nice man for nothing yeah yeah

don't want to steal liono Sanders story

but uh yeah and how did how did uh

chubby Pat smoking cigarettes end up

getting into

Triathlon um so I actually got into

Triathlon from Crossfit I moved to yeah

weird sort of thing I just I think I

just love

Colts yeah um but I moved to Adela from

Sydney to try and sort of get my act

together and finish a degree like I

started a degree earlier just out of

school um and like as a late sort of

adolescence early 20 I was just like

sort of partying heaps and doing stuff

that wasn't really that um productive

and I don't think I was really that

happy so when I moved to Adelaide I was

like I need something to give me some

more regiment and some more discipline

uh and Crossfit was like totally that

it's like you know train five days a

week eat really clean which was perfect

for studies um and after I did that for

two years I loved that I signed up for


Triathlon um Co hit so the triathlon

that I was meant to do in like two

months for with like no preparation just

as a sort of bucket list thing uh turned

into like six months of preparation uh

joined like a try try group because

there was one at the pool and they were

like come train with us um and yeah I

did like after a year of doing some

triathlons like local Sprint distance

ones in Adelaide I did my first half

distance uh triathon which was

in Murray man um Adelaide which is like

their local one you live swim in like

this barura Lake sort of thing um and I

did that in like 425 and then like a

month later I went on to do cans in like

425 as well yeah but um yeah as soon as

I got in Triathlon I absolutely loved it

like I got to taste of the progress I

got to just like found out about how

there's so many variables and factors

you can manipulate to become sort of

faster and I nerded out on that so hard

like I've always loved science so it was

just it had everything yeah that's

awesome man that's awesome I I kind of

had a similar thing like just through Co

I had a mate who had a bike and we used

to go for some little bike rides within

our radius of course

um R you know we were like oh let's go

to the pool let's go for a little run

and um yeah similar

timeline um yeah would you that's that's

like pretty good performance off the bat

like are you would you say you're kind

of naturally inclined or you just a

really hard worker and you really

enjoyed it or like why why did you get


early yeah I mean I think I am maybe

naturally and genetically like a good

runner um my like my mom runs probably

more KS a week than me she runs like 70

k a week uh and she's 60 something years

old she is this like

little boss woman who um just works so

hard um and yeah runs all the time so I

definitely get a bit of my work ethic

and probably genetically my running from

her yeah and how did you go with uh with

swimming being new to triathon because I

know like you're a pretty good swimmer

as well and that's kind of something

that if you didn't start doing it can

take forever to wrap your head

around yeah I mean I hate to like say

this but I feel like I'm actually a

really s like when you talk about I

mean I'm looking at like uh the top of

the age group athletes and like the

bottom of the pros so I guess I'm like

comparing myself to a pretty high bar um

but yeah no I am like an all right

swimmer because I did um like as an

Australian um you know you do like you

have to learn to swim and sometimes you

go into Squad my mom does Squad like uh

three times a week and I went into like

some Squad until I was old enough to say

I didn't want to do it anymore um and

then I you know dropped swimming didn't

do any of it until I started try on

again except for like going to the beach

and stuff like I've always been

comfortable in the ocean um my family

like loves the ocean we would go on like

beach holidays and stuff but that's

that's really my swim background yeah

yeah yeah I think that seems to be a lot

of Australians people

um the amount that they've swam like

they've did a bit of swim training in

school and maybe a little bit of squad

here and there but um even just doing

that as a kid that seems to get you to a

certain level that you just if you

started as a late like an adult onset

swimmer it just seems not insurmountable

but that much harder like I hear people

really struggle with it yeah yeah yeah

100% like I think it's even just the

confidence like swimming is a sport

where you're doing like everything

against your Basic Instincts like you're

sort of like putting your head

underwater and like trying to exert

yourself like where you can't breathe it

just doesn't make any sense I think like

yeah and I it's such a technique focused

thing like the flexibility like those

people who actually grow up swimming

they have shoulders that can you know go

all the way back um and I think that's a

huge benefit um like even to know the

motor pattern yeah so I guess I am lucky

in that and be grateful to my for

putting me into that and also just to be

from such a beautiful country that has

water surrounding it yeah absolutely

like I guess in Sydney I mean I don't

know how far away from from the coast

you are but um J it's blood a good place

to swim there's worse places to be for a

swimmer that's for sure yeah yeah I mean

what you're from Wei right that's right

got any any pools or water around we we

had a really good uh 33 M Pool which is

a strange length but you do three laps

and it's 100

met um oh all

right that's pretty good that's like

more than long course isn't it oh wait

no yeah yeah yeah no sorry more than

more than a short course yeah yeah yeah

yeah yeah so no we it's it's one of

those little towns that always something

about rural towns and they always claim

they're like the sportiest town in

Australia that's one of our towns as

well so um yeah well like there's all

these towns that have like you know five

Ian which would mean like per capita

they're like the densest populated place

of elite athletes yeah that's exactly

what it is the work ethic or something

something in the water not well yeah not

the best place to swim that's for sure

um but mate I missed you the other week

when you were down for Melbourne

70.3 um where you took the 25 to 29 age


win yeah yeah and fifth I think fifth or

sixth overall amateur

incredible fantastic man that's that's

insane um do you want to tell us about

that how that went down for

you yeah yeah so like going into

Melbourne I knew I was pretty fit like

my bike power was better than it had

ever been um I had a really dialed in

position or like I tried to dial in my

position I guess you can never know if

you don't go to um a wind tunnel which

is something I won't ever go to or not

in the near future um uh but I had like

two shocking races before that with cans

derailed by sickness and Sunshine Coast

just like not panning out with the bike

slow as hell so I went into Melbourne

even though I knew I was fit but I just

had like tried to have no expectations

because I didn't want to be so like sort

of disappointed uh but I also had a

pretty massive chip on my shoulder

thinking that I was so much better than

like those

results um yeah I guess do you want me

to talk about the race or yeah man do do

you want to go to it go through it from

the top just um when did you fly down


or um when did I fly down I flew down no

Friday early Friday morning um cool and

I tried to like I've been trying to get

to races earlier I mean obviously that's

a constraint not being like a full-time

athlete being a lifestyle athlete um but

got there like you know put my bike

together real early to try and sort of

take the stress off everything like get

everything sorted Friday did some

Recons um Friday and Saturday um swam

both days at the moment I've been

swimming like every day of the week I

would say just to get feel for the water

um so I did a couple of those um feeling

pretty good in the water I mean I

thought that the swim would definitely

be on because the water wasn't that bad

but then the wind just picked up like an

insane amount on Saturday AR though to

the point where I was just like this

race is going to be terrible and so

slow um but the swim did get changed as

people might know it got changed to like

900 or a th000

MERS um uh and at first I was heaps

disappointed because I wanted to see

what time I could put down for like a

half distance um but when we actually

got in the water I was like okay this

was probably a good idea because it was

like just like there was swell like half

a meter coming straight onto you so like

for the first um you know out to the

first boy I was breathing to the front

because like you just couldn't like you

would just swallow water if you were

going to the side um but I think it kind

of um worked in my favor because I'm

pretty comfortable in the um in the

ocean and like with rough uh swell um so

yeah I got out of the swim in like

1345 which I was pretty happy with

because like I mean Hayden wild who's

just like an absolute fish came out I

think in 11 High 11 or something which

is sick so like I mean two minutes back

on him was pretty pretty good like I was

really happy with that yeah yeah um and

I don't know if that was because it was

so rough uh or yeah or what or I'm just

swimming well like were you swimming

within yourself or were you like really

trying to push it because such a short

swim like you you can hook in

or uh yeah I mean I did just try and

just go all out because I knew it was

just less than 15 minutes of of like you

know drowning so I just went for it um

and and I know also that the transition

for Melbourne is really long like you've

got to run so far into it so you can

really collect yourself if it was a

short transition I might think like you

know take it a little easier because

I've got to you know put my suit on put

my day out suit on um and got to get the

arms in and stuff because I swim with it

down to the waist because it just really

um helps with shoulder um like mobility

and like doesn't restrict you as much

but I just knew I'd have more time so I

could just absolutely send it um yeah

and that's what I did um and yeah onto

the bike I felt really good the power

was coming easy and I was moving well

um I like I stayed with a group for the

first lap but I was sort of like um on a

mission and just wanted to like get away

and do go as quick as I could so I just

pushed the second lap and I was just um

uh like going as hard as I could up the

hills well like within myself up the

hills because they're really short so

trying to carry momentum over them yeah

uh yeah and then luckily on the on the

second lap or sorry on the way back into

town I found a dude who was flying and

sort of tried to stay with him in the

legal distance um and I hopped off the

bike in 2 hours and um 11 minutes which

is my best bike time to to date which is

sick yeah so good man that Melbourne

course is is great for a good bike split

like it's pretty smooth bitchman and

like like you said those Rolling Hills

if you can keep your momentum up you can

just push straight over them like if you

just they're on a regular Saturday

morning Beach Road ride they seem bigger

but when you're doing like 45 whatever

Cs on a TT bike you just they nearly

feel flat you can just go straight over

the top so yeah yeah being arrow on them

like makes such a difference and just


getting much going into them I was gonna

I was going to ask your position you've

kind of moved your pads a little bit

closer together and are they further

out yeah so um like since last time I

did Melbourne I was on a cannon de like

an old canondale slice um which just

didn't really have the elbow um or just

the adjustability in the front end to

bring my elbows in so now I'm on a giant

Trinity um and I can adjust that so I

moved my elbows in you know they're

literally like an inch apart I would say

um and yeah out quite a bit because also

that was um like that frame geometry is

not it's quite short I think it's even

it was even like um the cada slice was a

UCI legal one so it can't be um you

can't really get that much reach on it

it's not meant to be like that so the

Trinity just allowed me to get a lot

longer which meant I could sort of like

straighten out my back um which yeah is

more Arrow or at least yeah it feels

more Arrow was that was that comfortable

for you like breathing and just to be

able to hold the position as

well I mean as comfortable as a TK

position is um it was pretty comfortable

and um like when I get into Race season

I'm doing any session on the TT bike so

all my efforts are in the TT position so

I'm just like trying to get to a point

where breathing and and I guess where my

threshold is in a TT position and it's

not um like on a Radia can push a lot

more power yeah so I guess it was it was

comfortable and I think the key to that

was just um

like familiarization and getting into it

yeah I think that's that's the thing you

can you can make your pads a bit more

narrow or change things just do it

incrementally and over time and then you

always end up in a in a good position

eventually oh yeah 100% like I've on um

Instagram I've been sort of talking

about uh how to get more arrow and I

mean you couldn't just jump from um you

know being on a road or like into your

first try appline into that position

because you would probably cook your

back you might not be able to push any

um any power at all and it just wouldn't

be comfortable and and for a long race

you need to be comfortable because if

you're not comfortable and you're moving

around you're just burning more calories

and you're not being efficient yeah yeah

so yeah finish up on the bike 211 did


say yeah 211 uh so that's like 41 and a

bit days per hour um yeah yeah I guess

Melbourne is quick but I was still I was

still really chuffed with that yeah

um com to T T2 throw the runners on what

are you in the aex meta

speeds yeah I'm in The aex Meta speed

Edge um because apparently it's better

for like a midfoot striker okay um the

the what's the other one the sky plus I

think better for just like you know a

canyon Elite Runner who lands on their

for foot um or just some people who just

like have drilled in running form and I

guess I'm not I'm not that so this works

really well for me were you in the

Endorphin speeds before or am I making

that up um not the speeds I was in the

um endorphin Elites yeah the green ones

the elite sorry yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah

I was in those um I like those but they

feel like a little sluggish I feel like

they'd be sick for an Iron Man or a

marathon but for something where you

need to really get your Cadence up um

like a 70.3 I think the edge is just so

like Snappy if you haven't tried the

edge I would definitely recommend trying

it because it's just like seems it

doesn't even feel like a super shoe

because it's just so like so much ground

feel and it's so responsive it's just so

easy to get the legs turning over when I

first tried the shoe I was like I'm a


Runner not to be a plug for AIC but yeah

hit me up out six no I love that man

love it um no bit of um yeah yeah shoe

stuff it's awesome so um finish the bike

come on to the run and you feeling all

right at this point you feeling

good yeah I I wasn't feeling um like as

I said the power was coming easy so I

wasn't feeling too cooked and I did try

and like I wasn't just sending it um

like recklessly I was staying within um

a Power Range um and trying to be

efficient where I could so I felt like I

had the

energy um and the plan was to get off

the bike and run like the first 5k real

comfortable um and then get into a

rhythm for the next 10 and then just

absolutely bury myself for the last six

um and I guess this wasn't really stuck

to as I was just like way too excited um

and I was looking for spots in the top

age groupers so like I just um I just

went out at what felt like comfortably

hard and I went through the first 10K in

3335 I'm pretty sure so it was probably

a little hot um but I did manage to get

into a rhythm and and 335s like it just

felt comfortable in the end so I guess

the Run training that went into that and

and where my form was at that point was

um was pretty good um especially as like

an improvement for my best um 70.3 run

before that was jalong like last year or

so and it was one

18 like mid um and yeah I in hindsight I

wish I pushed harder and got like a sub

75 half uh wow but yeah I ended up

finishing with a

1153 yeah oh right on the line Y yeah

yeah yeah that's awesome man that's


um yeah so good so do you have guys like

in your age group that you know are

always at the races and and you have

little rivalries with

yeah yeah definitely um like and even in

in the C in the coaching group that I'm

in you know I sort of pick someone who

I'm like oh that person's kind of at my

level um and some like probably delusion

like a delusion but I convinced myself

that I'm better than them and that I

should be beating them so then I mean

it's probably not the greatest mental um

game to play because then when you don't

and they probably are fitter than me um

I just get so defeated but I mean that's

what I do at most things um and yeah I

do have other people and I know the age

group is that are like the top um and

it's really fun to sort of like chase

them down and sort of try and learn what

they're good at and where I could catch

them but usually it's you know on the

Run yeah yeah awesome man um and so yeah

you're with RPG Timbo reads

coaching yeah yeah I've been with RPG

for uh since the start of this year like

I was Prett with um Steve McKenna's

group or just coached by Steve McKenna

but he had to like he was amazing but he

had to give up some responsibility to

sort of focus on his business and career

um and then I moved over to RPG under


Appleton yeah and that's that's been

going well for you like obviously the

proofs in the

pudding yeah yeah no it's been going

really well um I think RPG is just like

so profession


Triathlon um and has so much knowledge

being in the sport himself I mean Steve

has so much knowledge and Sam has so

much knowledge both being currently in

the sport in like the top top 50 I think

or top 60 um but yeah uh it's been it's

been really good like there's just so

much knowledge um and so many like yeah

knowledgeable people in the crewp yeah

do do you do any like big group

activities there in Sydney like is there

a few of you coached together no there's

not like I mean there's some RPG

athletes in Sydney but um no I haven't

really linked up with them we do um link

up at races um but most of my training

is just with like some friends like I've

got some cyclist friends and some

running friends it's all kind of like

segmented into that yeah yeah yeah seems

to work well um that's cool though that

you can catch up at the races and

everyone's in the RPG kits and

um yeah yeah yeah yeah it makes me feel

like I mean it makes everyone feel a

little bit less sort of like nervous

when you've got other people that are

sharing that sort of um you know stress

of the race sure dude also I I've this

is the uh the free Zoom meeting as

well so I was going to say whenever it

drops we we can just get back on and

we'll finish up and I'll spce them

together yeah yeah yeah sweet no problem

yeah um so what's your what's your

training been like like it's because

you've made pretty big improvements on

your on your run recently um and you

said your bike power was like alltime

high and swimming is going well like

what how's training for you at the

moment um yeah I mean there has been

improvements but my training's been the

same since probably June um at can like

before cans and stuff um I guess there

was probably a period at the start of

the Year where Appo was um like getting

to know me as an athlete and what worked

for me um but it's been the same in the

sense that like I do about an average of

like 16 to 18 hours per week and then

some bigger weeks at 20 hours um but

yeah it's just been been the same really

um I think my body's just gotten to this

time of the year where I've just

absorbed everything really well um and

then I have all the other factors

outside of the training itself pretty

dialed like at the moment yeah like as

far as diet and sleep and stress and


goes yeah yeah day like yeah trying to

work on getting good sleep um diet and

um yeah I guess doesn't relate to the

run but yeah trying to get the position

right um because I guess if I'm more

efficient on the bike I've got more um

energy left over for for the Run um and

I'm a yeah a pretty good runner so I

think I was probably capable of these

times before but I was coming off the

bike just too cooked um

to do anything yeah anything like that

and have you been focusing on any any

leg in

particular um always swimming like since

the start of this year um at the start

of this year Steve was getting yeah as

Steve was just still coaching me he was

getting me to do like over 20 hour sorry

20K swim weeks um and I did those for

like maybe two months at the start of

the year and then it dropped off when I

sort of had to get back to reality and

sort of like taking time off for um

holidays but then getting back to work

it's just like you can't swim 20ks a

week and also do the other disciplines

so um but that has stayed a focus like

swimming's probably about like 30% of my

um like weekly training um so I do focus

on that and then it's so would probably

be bik's first Focus um just because you

have to spend the most time on that but

then big focus on swimming and then

running is the least like 20% of my week

is running yeah wow I guess you can only

do so much can't you like with swimming

and cycling you can do as much really um

until you get completely bored with it

but with with the Run there's only so

much load you can put into the

legs yeah exactly and I think with

running especially for a triathlete it's

a lot more about quality than quantity

um I mean most people can't tolerate

like a 100 k run week um and I don't

think it's even smart to go to that um

if you can still get benefits from doing

50 or 60 K with good

quality yeah yeah and are you on the

trainer a lot for your bike or you're

outdoor a lot of the time as

well uh yeah like leading up to races uh

like all of my sessions like all the

actual sessions would be on the trainer

just because you're in that TT position

and it's not really safe to be pushing

high power in the TT position like at

least around Sydney I mean I don't have

any long stretches like other places in

Australia um but yeah most of my like

interval sessions will be on the trainer

and then my easy rid sometimes I'll just

take a mountain bike out uh cruise

around or the Roadie and cruise around

but that's usually always Outdoors yeah

yeah and like just watching some uh some

YouTube or something yeah watching a bit

of like uh Lon of Sanders or something

like that you know get some motivation

depends where I'm at in the training

cycle sometimes it'll be like at the

start where my motivation High it'll be

like line of Sanders and then towards

the end when I'm so worn out it would

just be like modern family or something

like that because I'm I don't even want

to think about try hard blood like I'm

already doing it I don't need to like

double up on it yeah it gets a bit like

that doesn't it like I find when I'm

really pumped up I'll put on like some I

don't know some like EDM concert or some

like Las Vegas electronic festival or

something but um sometimes it's just

like some podcast on YouTube and just

just I don't know something to take the

focus away yeah to just like pass the

time because I mean you know only 20 or

even 10% of your week is actually that

intense stuff like you think that

training and I mean you see all the

YouTube videos of videos of people um

like Lionel and stuff you're just like

constantly sending it but like that's

just like such a small percentage of the

time especially in longdistance triathon

it's all just like aerobic miles um yeah

so you're just like passing the time

really the best one I found recently was

the um lifetime Grand Prix gravel series

it's it's like six I think six rounds uh

and they did it like Netflix style like

they sit down and interview the writers

and um oh like gravel like gravel road

gravel racing yeah oh sick there's so

many of those series like um drive to

survive like after drive to survive

coming out that are just so good it's

exactly that PTO yeah can't wait for p

to do something more like that like sort

of more professional like I mean it's

obviously already professional but long

I was pretty excited I was sitting there

on the trainer watching it and I caught

a glimpse and I was like hang on did I

just see what I think I saw and I

skipped it back and it was uh I think I

think his name is Brendan Johnson uh

treky he's like the Australian gravel

champ he's on there wearing some day out

socks so no

way day out kit yeah been seeing so much

more I think it's um it's coming up it's

a good brand to be supporting goodand to

be wearing yeah absolutely especially C

sleeves I just the the next thing that's

going to come up is I think I'll do some

pink ones for the fans of a little bit

of a bright color just just something a

little bit more yeah yeah bit of a Sam

long fan zo's

business yeah

yeah and so with your I'll cop some of

those I'll wear some of those that'll be

fresh absolutely man they'll stand out


sure um yeah so you you've also

mentioned you you've lost a bit of

weight as well you've come down what'

you say from like 82 to 78 kilos or

something I was um at um I guess to to

preface it I guess this is a tricky

question because I think the whole

Topic's pretty like taboo in in focusing

on it too much but I was at um in

Sunshine Coast um which is to two months

ago now I guess maybe no maybe more I

don't know um I was 84 kilos um just

about and now uh or I mean now I'm

probably Rising pretty quick because I'm

eating cheesecake like this like it's

going out of fashion but

um but at um Melbourne I was probably 78

High um uh and I it's not because I've

been focusing on the weight per se but

I've been focusing massively on um fat

utilization which is something that uh

re got me on two after I had like a

pretty shocking performance at um

Sunshine Coast and I just didn't run to

my ability interesting it's uh is this

kind of somewhat related to like Dan

ples and uh his his

methodology yeah I mean Rey was actually

um coached by Dan ples at a point

he's told I think Dan PL is um maybe a

little bit more extreme yeah um or there

are like more extreme people who follow

the low carb approach um but mine I

think was a little bit more lenient than

that um I um like talked with him about

not being able to perform or like just

not having anything in my legs for the

run off the um Sunshine Coast bike which

my power was like pretty decent it was


2 85 normalized I think um but uh I

talked with him and he was like yeah

mate we've just got to get you uh

utilizing fats better so you've actually

got like carbs spare in the tank by the

time you get to the run and he sort of

said to me um the way you're going to

have to do this is is to change your

diet or I guess he looked at my diet and

was like you're just eating too many

carbs all the time so your body's not

having to work to utilize fat which is

like what you're going to have to like I

mean in a half distance race you're

Racing for 4 hours like I mean even over

2 hours it's it's fat burning like there

is a lot of fat burning in there you

can't be at threshold for two hours so

we looked at my diet and um it was

pretty like pretty strict at first it

was like um no uh processed carbs

outside of training sessions W all the

time um yeah and I was like geez how am

I going to do this but I was also like

um here we go like here's something that

like might be a big change um let's give

it a crack um and it was also limiting

um my carb intake for the day outside of

sessions to about 200 on like the bigger

days and 150 on the um shorter days and

as low as like 100 on an easy aerobic

day um and I guess when I say outside of

sessions I mean like inside of sessions

like if they were hard I was still

crunching up to like nine 90 grams a

carb um and it was a hard session I was

just like sneaking bread in all the

I couldn't eat outside of it yeah just

to like go hard on it um but I mean it

wasn't easy um it took like and also you

you're not living like a normal person

to be like oh yeah no I'm not going to

have that I'm not going to have pasta

I'm not going to have rice and all of

that but I mean if you can dedicate a

bit of time to it and be a little bit

strict for a while um I think it makes a

huge difference because I could um like

towards the end of the block I could you

know eat just fats for the day and still

could ride it you know up to 200 30 um

like sort of power or like

250 uh I could do it all day um and I

could run you know my up to like my

aerobic Pace all day and I could do sort

of any swim except for like a hard

session um without you know any serious

carbs and I mean if you're talking about

like 100 grams of carb a day that's if

you try and measure that out it's like

nothing um and I think the weight loss

aspect that just happened because I

don't how you don't have any excess

calories um when you are um like eating

so clean and also when you're only

giving yourself carbs for hard sessions

you just don't have any excess calories

so I think my body composition changed

massively because I was one burning fat

and just not giving my body like excess

calories yeah so like the opposite the

opposite of the Norwegians no you're

looking very ripped you're looking like

a like a real athlete the uh yeah the

numbers add up yeah yeah yeah yeah we

got to be careful though everyone's a


athlete looking looking like a Jan frino

mated athlete it's

a for for like body composition and and

size and look you know it's there's a

bit of everything there's tall slim boys

there's shorter shorter bigger boys it's

um or people I should say it's um I

don't know different people play play to

their strengths I

suppose yeah and I think um you've

totally got to like um acknowledge like

what your body type is like I'm never

going to look like Yann forino and I'm

okay with that because I'm just like

more um built and I just carry more

muscle which is actually a good thing

like if you're ever worried about having

more fat or being sort of like stockier

I think you should like stop that and

acknowledge that you've got like a

massive benefit behind you because you

can tolerate like I think because I hold

more muscle and I hold more fat easily I

can tolerate more load um and I think

everyone like if you start the sport as

a rake um and you start the sport

already looking like a triathlete uh I

think you're probably pretty screwed

like because you're just not going to be

able to take the pounding of like the

bike um and the Run um like you see

these thin athletes like um like I heard

REI and like those guys talking on their

podcast about who's going to be the next

great middle distance athlete from itu

and someone like they were saying

someone like Alex e is not going to make

it unless he puts on like five

kilos yeah interesting so I think you've

got to be got to be careful with it and

don't focus on the weight just like if

you start to if you're doing actually

all the training and you're being like

smart about the choices you make with

food and that sort of stuff you will get

lean I don't think look at the scales

too much yeah that's just the by

product yeah exactly um and and it's not

yeah it's not easy um on those on those

like and in the first few weeks or in

the first month of that like fat

utilization process it's just like you

feel so depleted but then you get so

much energy it's weird then you feel

like almost wired that's great what so

what does like a what was your diet like

before like a day worth of food like

your breakfast lunch and dinner compared

to what you what you've been eating

now uh so like on an easy day let's say

before on an easy day I'd just have you

know like oats um or even like I make

these like oat pancakes um for

breakfast um I might even if I had a

like any sort of session um I might have

like you know white toast before it to

get some carbs in um and then for lunch

you know it'd be like um rice and meat

and stuff like that and then for dinner

similar like rice some sort of carb and

protein so like normal normal stuff and

also I think what you would think is a

pretty good diet and I think there's so

much information out there that like

people would have you believe that that

is a good diet and I think for some

people it might be um but to change that

afterwards um if I had an easy session

in the morning I probably wouldn't eat

before it I'd just have um my like

coffee and then go to the pool if it was

a longer session like so um you know

like two hours aerobic on the bike I

might have like eggs and bacon or I

might have like yogurt um and nuts on

top um and then sort of topping up with

protein afterwards if it's a big session

and then at lunch it would be um on an

easy day it would be just like protein

um so some sort of meat

uh like I guess or you could have tofu

or something and um vegetables like

weren't starchy so like not potatoes it

would be like maybe a little bit of

pumpkin and then you'd have like


cauliflower and like so much salad I was

eating so much salad on like easy days

and then for dinner yeah protein salad

some sort of like not starchy vegetable

unless it was a hard day the next day

then it would be some you know some

potatoes some sarue vegetable but I

wasn't really eating any um

like I I wasn't eating any pasta or not

really any rice unless it was like a

race simulation the next day yeah so

really only fueling with carbs when you

needed the carbs otherwise just just not

just just fats and proteins yeah yeah

exactly and I think um at first like my

thought was like oh God my training's

going to go to um and I think I did

feel pretty low energy but um

but you sort of like adapt to it and I

think the best or the safest time to do

it also um to say like I wouldn't do

this unless you've got a professional um

giving you advice on it um like don't

take my word for it and also I probably

wouldn't do it if you're like some tiny

um you know athlete with 5% body fat

because you're just not it's going to be

terrible for your body um but yeah yeah

yeah yeah interesting forget the


there oh no yeah just just uh yeah

mostly mostly fats and proteins um is

this sustainable like now post race like

do you want to continue with this diet

oh not at all um not at all not

sustainable like so I think you can do

this in

phases um I

think not having the carbs is probably

not good for your hormones and maybe

even like your brain um so one I want to

eat more carbs now uh because I want to

be like a normal person for at least my

offseason and then two um I actually

want to put like I want to intentionally

or just as it happens put weight back on

because it's um like it's essential for

your hormones um like when you're really

low body fat and you're in a um calorie

deficit your like your testosterone's

going so so low so I think that's why

it's a real fine line um to be able to

do it and I think that's why it's

important to have a professional um to

overlook to make sure you're not like

like affecting your bone density or your

like testosterone levels or your immune

system uh so yeah now I'm just going

back to eating normally I mean like I

still probably eat healthy but yeah have

treats and all that yeah that's so true

like you don't want to be uh under

fueling and trying to do all this

training at the same time without a bit

of knowledge or someone helping you with

it because it's just recipe for disaster


think yeah yeah yeah 100% And like you

don't want to get um like you want to be

doing it for your training and not to

just look like a person you don't want

to be doing it just to look like Yan

frino um because that's just not

realistic body goals and and also then

you're defeating preps of it if you're

doing it just to be lean and then your

training goes to then what have you

done except for be like a bodybuilder

for a little bit yeah it's an

interesting space man like it's

something um I've never

really it's never bothered me to talk

about like diet or weight loss or

calorie counting but I know some people

like just fully can't do it um eating

disorders and it triggers people and uh

body dysmorphia and all those type of

things but

um within sports like it's it's usually

like within reason the light of the

better like especially with running the

lighter people go faster have did you

find like with your running being a bit

smaller you you moved a bit quicker do

you think that helped your

runtime yeah I think um to a degree for

sure um being lighter like I mean you're

just fighting inertia like always you

know it's harder to move a heavier


um but yeah you got to be like yeah yeah

I think it is a bit of a Dark Art in

sports like I mean in cycling in P

purist cycling they're doing it

to uh such a level that like no one who

watches cycling and like would actually

acknowled like know how seriously

they're they're cutting weight and yeah

I mean as you said I think people

talking about it more is probably better

for the whole stigmas around it and all

of that so people aren't just like

looking at other athletes and being like

what how are they so skinny because it's

like they are intentionally like doing

that like that's a factor they're

adjusting so yeah I think that it

probably did help my run and on the bike

yeah I think everyone who watches

cycling knows that it does like it

affects your power to weight ratio um

but I I I with like the supervision of

um RPG and like my coach Appo and re

doing it all safely um I actually

managed to like increase my power and

get lighter so my power to weight ratio

went up um like a lot um like at


at Sunshine Coast I was 84 and I pushed

to 85 and at uh like normalized power

and at

um at Cambra on Sunday a few days ago I

was probably 79 or 80 I mean I put on

like probably maybe a kilo just getting

some weight back on after Melbourne um

but I pushed 300 normalized power and I

was you know 79 80 so it's a big

difference in um power to weight ratio I

for the for the hills it probably helped

yeah the dream even for a course like

Melbourne that's relatively flat I don't

know what CRA had like 900 M elevation

didn't it yeah it did yeah it had 900

was it was it like a climb or like

rolling Rolling

Hills um yeah there was a few like

serious climbs there was one going up

into the Arboretum that was like um you

know like 12% it was just straight

uphill and then there were a few other

climbs out on course yeah th those kilos

matter like you everyone's kind of fast

in the same Pace on the flat but then

when things go uphill you see the little

guys just take off a lot of the time

yeah yeah but I I think being like at

like actually having muscle mass you

need to be able like you need muscle

mass to be able to just put raw power

down in time trailing for um triathon

because you see those little guys in

cycling don't um like don't do well on

the flats in just a regular time trial

except for like vingard but I mean what

is that guy on yeah that's a good

question um yeah mate do you want to

quickly touch on CRA so you backed it up

two weeks after

Melbourne yeah yeah for sure um I mean


Melbourne as I like I mean I was saying

before I just felt um like fine in the

first week but then in the second week I

think all of the fatigue caught up to me

so I went into this race like I mean

even planning it on my calendar I knew

it would be a bit of an uncertainty

about how my body would feel so soon

after to Melbourne um sort of my hips

and my left ITB was just like it felt

like it was on the edge of like

exploding it was so tight so I was just

like doing so much foam rolling and


balling um but I knew that I still had

Fitness like left over like I did I saw

in some run sessions the week before

like I did it probably maybe a little

bit stupidly I did a run session which

was like Hill reps on the Wednesday

before camera um that was just cuz I

went to a local run group and then I

just got sucked into the peer pressure

um maybe a little bit of like fragile

masculinity but um but I knew I still

had the fitness because I was still

moving well um so yeah um I guess I'll

talk through the race again if you want

um yeah yeah like through the swim uh so

like in the swim I knew it was going to

be slow because it was fresh water uh so

like the two days before I'd practiced

in the lake um and I knew like I needed

to sort of change my stroke a bit and be

like a little bit longer and smoother

stroke because you wouldn't have the

buoyancy of salt water on your side and

I couldn't just like turn the arms over

um at a crazy high Cadence um so yeah

when I went into that

um I actually felt pretty good like I

got out of the water in 27 High um on my

watch I think on the tracker it was like

28 so that was still like

127 128 pace

um and this put me just like off the

front of the so just like back from the

front of the age groupers the top age

groupers um which meant I was solo on

the bike um so I did really try to push

to start to bridge up um but I was like

on my own for most of it um I like I was

doing pretty good power but my legs were

just like so loaded from Melbourne uh so

it was really like a character building

race because I just had to just like

keep going even though I really really

wanted to stop um but I limited my power

to like 350 Watts for the longer climbs

but I probably had to go up to like 400

or above for like the Steep pinches to

should of keep some momentum um yeah I

mean it was because it was 960 M of

elevation it was a slow bike I got off


222 I think um and there there just

weren't really any opportunities to sit

on because it was so slow um uh like and

I guess I just didn't have a group of

anyone who uh was like similar in just

like I think the guys in front like Leon

who was leading the race was three

minutes um up the road

yeah yeah so like close chasing the

carrot but not quite on with them not

enough not close enough to be saving any

power yeah exactly like um Leon Shar

who's like penrith Tri Club I think he

won Weston Sydney um he's a he's a

strong cyclist and he gets fitted I

think by um 3D Bike fit so those guys

are all really dialed um so like I mean

I wasn't catching him like if I put in

some huge thing um huge surge I wouldn't

have got three minutes back on him

because he rode so well um so I just

needed to sort of be solo out there um

so yeah I got off the bike with 3

minutes back to the lead I was getting

some splits um and I kind of did the ma

in my head to be like if the GU up front

um like I know that Leon probably could

have run like a 118 or something but I

was like I'm G to have to do like the

same as Melbourne to catch him and I

would only just catch him at the finish

line so I mean this was a pretty

daunting um thing so then like I just

set off at the same pace I set off

335s um off the bike um and it was

definitely wasn't feeling as smooth as

Melbourne um I guess that shows like I

guess my how young I am in the sport I

can't absorb uh half dist that quick and

still be fresh maybe if I did Less in

the taper like even mentally did you

find you a little bit checked out

because you had such a good performance

in Melbourne you know you're like

there's there's tick there's my great

70.3 performance um was it harder to

just be mentally in it on on the Run

especially um I feel like in maybe in

like the week after Melbourne I sort of

rested on my Laurels a bit because I was

like this was a good race but then I

still was like it wasn't a full distance

because it was that shorten swim so I

was like I really want to know what I

can do and I didn't even know that the

course had 960 elevation on it so I was

thinking it was a fast flat course so I

was like oh I could you know go easily

under sub like under four

um so I was really looking at cber as

like now this is the aace in a sense

um but uh yeah no I guess I didn't have

that because I wanted a good time um so

I wasn't really checked out I was like

yeah pretty Keen to send it and I was

just telling myself like this is the

last race then you can take a break like

tomorrow is like going to be easy this

is the last brick session you need to do

for maybe like a month

um so yeah I just set off

335s I was hurting so bad uh but I still

went through 10K in

36 36 minutes or so um so dropping the

pace a bit um but but yeah still moving

all right but I mean it was hurting so

much and I had to drop back by halfway


345s and stay on that I was getting

splits from my girlfriend on the bik

um and it was coming down like it was

coming you know 3 minutes two minutes

and then I was catching some of the guys

who were in I was in fifth place and I

was catching some of the guys who were

in fourth and third um

until like it got to I think 2ks to go

and then I could see Leon in his like

red suit and it was like and he was just

he seemed like he was just there but it

was like so close but so far away and I

got off the bridge on the other side of

the course um

and I think he must have looked back and

seen me like up on the bridge he was

down running and I sort of needed to go

back he must have seen me and put in

this like I think he put in a surge or

maybe it was just me like weakening in

the mind and I was like oh well there

you go I'm not getting second like he is

too far away but I just kept plugging

away at like

345s and then when I could see he was

like um you know 10 m um and I had like

a split that was like you know less than

a minute I just like you know dug in I

don't think I got any faster but I

didn't get any slower and I think they

everyone else was cooked from that bike

um so I caught him like in the last yeah

like K in a bit um yeah and I I so like

I got up to him I didn't actually know

he was first I was like what position

are you in mate and he was like are you

on your third lap because I guess I mean

a bit of a power move he's like who are


mate um but uh I was like yeah I'm on my

third laugh and he's like well I think

you're winning now and I was like

cheering uh and I was sick and there was

a home stretch and I saw my girlfri was

there um and she was just like you're in

first place and I was just yeah so so

ecstatic to get it uh and come in and I

think I still got I got like 20 seconds

on first place after that sorry on

second place yeah massive mate what a

way to win what a way like like it's

still a solid bike but then to run

everyone down um I wouldn't know think

about I'm a terrible

Runner I mean that's like I guess it

shows that like I probably have or like

I even though I don't have any athletic

background I probably have been pretty

like genetically blessed for the run

like I mean genetically blessed sounds

like a bit of a but like good

all right at running coming from no

running history um and uh it's always

been that way for me that like I get off

the bike and I make up places um and I

think I love like the chase like I feel

like it would be so stressful being in

the lead and getting chased down like

think you just have to like you have to

keep running this whereas like I'm

thinking like I can keep running this

and you know all I can do is get better

from here like I don't often see people

come up from behind um and I mean I

probably will if I move on to like the

pro ranks well I definitely will well I

mean actually no I don't think I'll be

in front of people off the bik but but

yeah yeah and so this uh what was your

what was your half marathon for that

one for that it was

11740 yo fastest fastest age

group yeah fastest age group and six out

of 12 Pros insane mate that's so good

yeah I think it really like paid off to

like I run a lot in my training on tired

legs so it paid off to be able to just


a good Pace when my legs were just like

screaming for me to

stop um and so what's uh what's plans

for next year like do you want to do you

want to have another year just smashing

the will you be 30 next

year no no I'm only 27 I mean oh man

plenty more time to dominate that age

group yeah yeah um well I think I am

looking like for financial reasons I

reckon it makes sense

but to try and go and get my Pro license

um so I've already like I've already

sent an email to challenge about like

their Pro license uh I mean it's

going to be awkward if I put it out

there and I get denied but that's all

right you got to be

accountable um but yeah I'm looking to

go into the pro ranks and race that

because I think the Dynamics of Pro

Racing so much different like

racing uh as a mass start and having

people to work with on the bike

um and I think my Run's like pretty much

there um my bike definitely needs work

but I think I can find extra Watts

through training and getting more Arrow

like I am always looking at new ways to

be more Arrow yeah um and then I just

got to keep drilling the swimming um and

and I reckon I can Bridge up to be you

know a low Pro and then maybe one day

mid pack Pro yeah I mean I want to be

yeah I want to be a good Pro that would

be my goal but right now it's like just

be a pro like I mean yeah if I get my

Pro license see like a see like a

acceptance letter not that it's like

that it' just be some email being like

yeah transfer us to

$1,200 um it' be a little less romantic

than I'm imagining but I'll I'll

definitely have a tear in my eye because

it's been a sick goal of mine absolutely

man and does it I don't know is that

kind of um being at the the top of the

age group is that kind of like a big a

big tick for you like it's that's a

pretty big

deal as in winning the age group yeah um

yeah no I mean it's obviously sick to

win the age group because I think my uh

age group is so competitive but I feel

like at this stage I'm really looking

for like wins overall amateur wins and I

think this was my first like overall

amate to win in a reasonably big race

that I could be like really proud of and

that's starting to reflect where I think

I'm at um yeah yeah absolutely mate uh

well it sounds like you've got plenty

coming up but a bit of a bit of time off

and some cheesecake in the meantime

that's it 100% all the cheesecake I

could possibly want too good man well M

it's been great to hear uh hear your

racing is going well and um we'll

continue working together and get some

more day kit your way when we've got

some new stuff

released yeah yeah no I'm so excited I

know there are some some uh dope things

in the works some uh fast fast kit in

the works and some really awesome

designs coming up so yeah look forward

to it and I appreciate all the support

from you guys no thanks mate appreciate

it all the best mate Cheers Cheers

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